🌐 Mailman 3 June 2024 - Python-list - python.org

Difference method vs attribut = function
by Ulrich Goebel June 30, 2024

June 30, 2024

Hi, a class can have methods, and it can have attributes, which can hold a function. Both is well known, of course. My question: Is there any difference? The code snipped shows that both do what they should do. But __dict__ includes just the method, while dir detects the method and the attribute holding a function. My be that is the only difference? class MyClass: def __init__(self): functionAttribute = None def method(self): print("I'm a method") def function(): print("I'm a function passed to an attribute") mc = MyClass() mc.functionAttribute = function mc.method() mc.functionAttribute() print('Dict: ', mc.__dict__) # shows functionAttribute but not method print('Dir: ', dir(mc)) # shows both functionAttribute and method By the way: in my usecase I want to pass different functions to different instances of MyClass. It is in the context of a database app where I build Getters for database data and pass one Getter per instance. Thanks for hints Ulrich -- Ulrich Goebel <ml(a)fam-goebel.de>

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[RELEASE] Python 3.13.0 beta 3 released.
by Thomas Wouters June 27, 2024

June 27, 2024

The *next to last* Python 3.13 beta version, beta 3, is now released: https://www.python.org/downloads/release/python-3130b3/ *This is a beta preview of Python 3.13* Python 3.13 is still in development. This release, 3.13.0b3, is the third of four beta release previews of 3.13. Beta release previews are intended to give the wider community the opportunity to test new features and bug fixes and to prepare their projects to support the new feature release. We *strongly encourage* maintainers of third-party Python projects to *test with 3.13* during the beta phase and report issues found to the Python bug tracker <https://github.com/python/cpython/issues> as soon as possible. While the release is planned to be feature complete entering the beta phase, it is possible that features may be modified or, in rare cases, deleted up until the start of the release candidate phase (Tuesday 2024-07-30). Our goal is to have no ABI changes after beta 4 and as few code changes as possible after 3.13.0rc1, the first release candidate. To achieve that, it will be *extremely important* to get as much exposure for 3.13 as possible during the beta phase. Please keep in mind that this is a preview release and its use is *not* recommended for production environments. <https://discuss.python.org/t/python-3-13-0-beta-3-now-available/56847#major…>Major new features of the 3.13 series, compared to 3.12 Some of the new major new features and changes in Python 3.13 are: <https://discuss.python.org/t/python-3-13-0-beta-3-now-available/56847#new-f…>New features - A new and improved interactive interpreter <https://docs.python.org/3.13/whatsnew/3.13.html#a-better-interactive-interp…>, based on PyPy <https://pypy.org>’s, featuring multi-line editing and color support, as well as colorized exception tracebacks <https://docs.python.org/3.13/whatsnew/3.13.html#improved-error-messages> . - An *experimental* free-threaded build mode <https://docs.python.org/3.13/whatsnew/3.13.html#free-threaded-cpython>, which disables the Global Interpreter Lock, allowing threads to run more concurrently. The build mode is available as an experimental feature in the Windows and macOS installers as well. - A preliminary, *experimental* JIT <https://docs.python.org/3.13/whatsnew/3.13.html#experimental-jit-compiler>, providing the ground work for significant performance improvements. - The (cyclic) garbage collector is now incremental <https://docs.python.org/3.13/whatsnew/3.13.html#incremental-garbage-collect…>, which should mean shorter pauses for collection in programs with a lot of objects. - A modified version of mimalloc <https://github.com/microsoft/mimalloc> is now included, optional but enabled by default if supported by the platform, and required for the free-threaded build mode. - Docstrings now have their leading indentation stripped <https://docs.python.org/3.13/whatsnew/3.13.html#other-language-changes>, reducing memory use and the size of .pyc files. (Most tools handling docstrings already strip leading indentation.) - The dbm module <https://docs.python.org/3.13/library/dbm.html> has a new dbm.sqlite3 backend <https://docs.python.org/3.13/whatsnew/3.13.html#dbm> that is used by default when creating new files. - The minimum supported macOS version was changed from 10.9 to *10.13 (High Sierra)*. Older macOS versions will not be supported going forward. <https://discuss.python.org/t/python-3-13-0-beta-3-now-available/56847#typin…> Typing - Support for type defaults in type parameters <https://peps.python.org/pep-0696/>. - A new type narrowing annotation <https://peps.python.org/pep-0742/>, typing.TypeIs. - A new annotation for read-only items in TypeDicts <https://peps.python.org/pep-0705/>. <https://discuss.python.org/t/python-3-13-0-beta-3-now-available/56847#remov…>Removals and new deprecations - PEP 594 (Removing dead batteries from the standard library) <https://peps.python.org/pep-0594/> scheduled removals of many deprecated modules: aifc, audioop, chunk, cgi, cgitb, crypt, imghdr, mailcap, msilib, nis, nntplib, ossaudiodev, pipes, sndhdr, spwd, sunau, telnetlib, uu, xdrlib, lib2to3. - Many other removals <https://docs.python.org/3.13/whatsnew/3.13.html#removed> of deprecated classes, functions and methods in various standard library modules. - C API removals <https://docs.python.org/3.13/whatsnew/3.13.html#id10> and deprecations <https://docs.python.org/3.13/whatsnew/3.13.html#id9>. (Some removals present in alpha 1 were reverted in alpha 2, as the removals were deemed too disruptive at this time.) - New deprecations <https://docs.python.org/3.13/whatsnew/3.13.html#deprecated>, most of which are scheduled for removal from Python 3.15 or 3.16. (Hey, *fellow core developer,* if a feature you find important is missing from this list, let Thomas know <thomas(a)python.org>.) For more details on the changes to Python 3.13, see What’s new in Python 3.13 <https://docs.python.org/3.13/whatsnew/3.13.html>. The next pre-release of Python 3.13 will be 3.13.0b4, currently scheduled for 2024-07-16. <https://discuss.python.org/t/python-3-13-0-beta-3-now-available/56847#more-…>More resources - Online Documentation <https://docs.python.org/3.13/> - PEP 719 <https://peps.python.org/pep-0719/>, 3.13 Release Schedule - Report bugs at https://github.com/python/cpython/issues. - Help fund Python directly <https://www.python.org/psf/donations/python-dev/> (or via GitHub Sponsors <https://github.com/sponsors/python>), and support the Python community <https://www.python.org/psf/donations/>. <https://discuss.python.org/t/python-3-13-0-beta-3-now-available/56847#enjoy…>Enjoy the new releases Thanks to all of the many volunteers who help make Python Development and these releases possible! Please consider supporting our efforts by volunteering yourself or through organization contributions to the Python Software Foundation. Regards from *scorchingly* hot Amsterdam (hey, we get good weather too!), Your release team, Thomas Wouters Łukasz Langa Ned Deily Steve Dower -- Thomas Wouters <thomas(a)python.org>

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How to install tensorflow on Python 2.7 in Windows?
by marc nicole June 26, 2024

June 26, 2024

Browsing the available version of tensorflow for the dates before January 2021 (date when Python 2.7 stopped being supported) I can't find a tensorflow version for Python 2.7 that works under Windows. The reference site I use is https://pypi.org/project/tensorflow/ Anybody can point out a compatible .whl file with Python 2.7 and Windows?

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Re: Anonymous email users
by Anton Shepelev June 25, 2024

June 25, 2024

Chris Angelico to dn: > > Python mailing-lists are covered by the Code of Conduct > > and monitored by ListAdmins. Thus, there are controls > > which limit the impact which advertisers and others with > > non-pythonic aims might otherwise exert! > > So long as there's a newsgroup gateway, those controls are > toothless. The gateway operator can have the usual anti-spam software installed, and of course there is Gmane: <https://gmane.io/> which actually subscribes users to mailing lists (on their behalf). Gmane's NNTP server is: news.gmane.io . -- () ascii ribbon campaign -- against html e-mail /\ www.asciiribbon.org -- against proprietary attachments

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Re: Anonymous email users
by Sebastian Wells June 25, 2024

June 25, 2024

On Fri, 14 Jun 2024 18:00:37 -0400, avi.e.gross wrote: > I notice that in some recent discussions, we have users who cannot be > replied to directly as their email addresses are not valid ones, and I > believe on purpose. Examples in the thread I was going to reply to are: > > <mailto:HenHanna@devnull.tb> HenHanna(a)devnull.tb > > <mailto:no.email@nospam.invalid> no.email(a)nospam.invalid > > <mailto:candycanearter07@candycanearter07.nomail.afraid> > candycanearter07(a)candycanearter07.nomail.afraid (user <candycane> is > generated from /dev/urandom) > > I know some here suggest that we only reply to the wider community and > they have a point. But I think there is a role for having some > conversations offline and especially when they are not likely to be > wanted, or even tolerated, by many in the community. > > Using such fake or invalid emails makes it hard to answer the person > directly or perhaps politely ask them for more info on their request or > discuss unrelated common interests. Worse, when I reply, unless I use > reply-all, my mailer sends to them futilely. When I do the reply-all, I > have to edit out their name or get a rejection. > The spammers won the spam wars, so even if you have someone's real e-mail address, that's no guarantee that you can contact them. You certainly wouldn't be able to contact me at my real e-mail address, unless you also had my phone number, so you could call me and tell me that you sent me an e-mail, and what the subject line was so I can find it. I don't even open my e-mail inbox unless there's a specific message I'm expecting to find there right now. With e-mail addresses being phone-validated, it's not easy to create a new one either. And even if I did, you can't even trust e-mail providers not to give your address out to spammers. The only function e-mail addresses serve now is to positively identify the sender of a Usenet posting so he can be targeted for harassment, lawsuits, or worse.

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Re: [Tutor] How to go about a simple object grabbing in python (given coordinates of arms and objects)
by marc nicole June 24, 2024

June 24, 2024

What are the parameters to account for in this type of algorithm? are there some checks to perform the arm moves ? for example angle moves or cartesian moves based on some distance thresholds? Any idea about the pseudo-algorithm is welcome. Thanks. Le dim. 23 juin 2024 à 10:33, Alan Gauld via Tutor <tutor(a)python.org> a écrit : > On 22/06/2024 13:41, marc nicole wrote: > > > So, given the x,y,z coordinates of a target object and the offset x,y,z > of > > arms of a robot, what is a good algorithm to perform to grab the object > > between the hands (either from both sides or from below all using both > > hands). > > > > Specifically, my problem is applied to a NAO robot environment where I > > retrieve a target object coordinates using the following code: > > This is almost entirely outside the Python domain and all within > your 3rd party environment. Do they have a user forum or mailing > list? You will probably get better results asking there? > > Another possibility is that you are using a Python wrapper around > a C (or other language) library and there might be FAQs, fora or > lists supporting that. If so you should be able to translate > their examples to your Python code? > > In terms of generic solutions the only thing I can suggest that > might help is to research collision detection algorithms. > Wikipedia is likely a good starting point. > > -- > Alan G > Author of the Learn to Program web site > http://www.alan-g.me.uk/ > http://www.amazon.com/author/alan_gauld > Follow my photo-blog on Flickr at: > http://www.flickr.com/photos/alangauldphotos > > > > _______________________________________________ > Tutor maillist - Tutor(a)python.org > To unsubscribe or change subscription options: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor >

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Re: Decoding bytes to text strings in Python 2
by Rayner Lucas June 24, 2024

June 24, 2024

In article <mailman.159.1718991773.2909.python-list(a)python.org>, rosuav(a)gmail.com says... > > If you switch to a Linux system, it should work correctly, and you'll > be able to migrate the rest of the way onto Python 3. Once you achieve > that, you'll be able to operate on Windows or Linux equivalently, > since Python 3 solved this problem. At least, I *think* it will; my > current system has a Python 2 installed, but doesn't have tkinter > (because I never bothered to install it), and it's no longer available > from the upstream Debian repos, so I only tested it in the console. > But the decoding certainly worked. Thank you for the idea of trying it on a Linux system. I did so, and my example code generated the error: _tkinter.TclError: character U+1f40d is above the range (U+0000-U+FFFF) allowed by Tcl So it looks like the problem is ultimately due to a limitation of Tcl/Tk. I'm still not sure why it doesn't give an error on Windows and instead either works (when UTF-8 encoding is specified) or converts the out-of-range characters to ones it can display (when the encoding isn't specified). But now I know what the root of the problem is, I can deal with it appropriately (and my curiosity is at least partly satisfied). This has given me a much better understanding of what I need to do in order to migrate to Python 3 and add proper support for non-ASCII characters, so I'm very grateful for your help! Thanks, Rayner

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Re: [Tutor] How to go about a simple object grabbing in python (given coordinates of arms and objects)
by marc nicole June 22, 2024

June 22, 2024

My code is just an attempt at the task, it is not exact as what relates to the coordinates (e.g., doesn't account for the size of the object. I would like to have a idea on the general approach to such problems (even a pseudo code would do) "Get the hands rapidly enough in the vicinity and then do some fine coordinated motions to capture the object and then presumably move it." seems to be a good approach indeed, The grabbing with both hands code should be more precise. Thanks for the help anyways! Le sam. 22 juin 2024 à 23:04, ThreeBlindQuarks <threesomequarks(a)proton.me> a écrit : > Marc, > > Could you specify what is wrong with what you are doing? you show us code > that uses an environment you point to that is largely outside of basic > Python. > > There is no one way to get from point A to point B and various constraints > you have not mentioned can apply. How many joints does the assemblage have > and what are the limits and costs associated with each. Cam there be > barriers along a route, including to the side where they may brush part of > your equipment. Are other things moving (independently even) that may end > up blocking. > > You seem to need both "hands" and presumably at the same time. So > solutions can take that into account. You need to define what is meant by > contacting the object to move and you don't want to approach it and hit > with some speed. > > So, the problem may be in parts. Get the hands rapidly enough in the > vicinity and then do some fine coordinated motions to capture the object > and then presumably move it. > > If you could point to what code is not doing what is expected, someone who > knows the details or is willing to learn, might help, If you want an > overall algorithm, there may be some people could share but they may not > easily translate into the package of sorts you are using. > > But the web site you point us to may well already contain examples of > doing some aspects that you might learn from. > > For me, this is too detailed to focus on as I struggle to figure out how > to move my hands to different parts of my keyboard while looking ... > > And that may be one variant of an algorithm where instead of trying to > move all the way, you move art-way and LOOK where you are, then repeat. > > > Sent with Proton Mail secure email. > > On Saturday, June 22nd, 2024 at 8:41 AM, marc nicole <mk1853387(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > > > Hello to all of this magnificent community! > > > > I have this problem I had already spent a few days on and still can't > > figure out a proper solution. > > > > So, given the x,y,z coordinates of a target object and the offset x,y,z > of > > arms of a robot, what is a good algorithm to perform to grab the object > > between the hands (either from both sides or from below all using both > > hands). > > > > Specifically, my problem is applied to a NAO robot environment where I > > retrieve a target object coordinates using the following code: > > > > tracker_service= session.service("ALTracker") > > xyz_pos = tracker_service.getTargetPosition(motion.FRAME_TORSO) > > > > > > src: > > > http://doc.aldebaran.com/2-8/naoqi/motion/control-cartesian.html#motion-car… > > > > > > Then I get to move the right arm towards nearby the object using the > > following code: > > > > effector = "RArm" > > > > frame = motion.FRAME_TORSO > > effector_offset = > > almath.Transform(self.motion.getTransform(effector, frame, False)) > > effector_init_3d_position = almath.position3DFromTransform( > > effector_offset) > > > > target_3d_position = almath.Position3D(target_position) > > move_3d = target_3d_position - effector_init_3d_position > > moveTransform = almath.Transform.fromPosition(move_3d.x, > > move_3d.y, move_3d.z) > > target_transformer_list = list(moveTransform.toVector()) > > times = [2.0] > > axis_mask_list = motion.AXIS_MASK_VEL > > self.motion.transformInterpolations(effector, frame, > > target_transformer_list, axis_mask_list, times). > > > > src: > http://doc.aldebaran.com/1-14/dev/python/examples/almath/index.html?highlig… > > This question is specific to NAO environment but in general how to go > > about this task? what is a most common algorithm used in this case? Do > > I have to also get the side of the object in order to know where > > exactly the arms should be placed? > > _______________________________________________ > > Tutor maillist - Tutor(a)python.org > > To unsubscribe or change subscription options: > > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor >

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How to go about a simple object grabbing in python (given coordinates of arms and objects)
by marc nicole June 22, 2024

June 22, 2024

Hello to all of this magnificent community! I have this problem I had already spent a few days on and still can't figure out a proper solution. So, given the x,y,z coordinates of a target object and the offset x,y,z of arms of a robot, what is a good algorithm to perform to grab the object between the hands (either from both sides or from below all using both hands). Specifically, my problem is applied to a NAO robot environment where I retrieve a target object coordinates using the following code: tracker_service= session.service("ALTracker") xyz_pos = tracker_service.getTargetPosition(motion.FRAME_TORSO) src: http://doc.aldebaran.com/2-8/naoqi/motion/control-cartesian.html#motion-car… Then I get to move the right arm towards nearby the object using the following code: effector = "RArm" frame = motion.FRAME_TORSO effector_offset = almath.Transform(self.motion.getTransform(effector, frame, False)) effector_init_3d_position = almath.position3DFromTransform( effector_offset) target_3d_position = almath.Position3D(target_position) move_3d = target_3d_position - effector_init_3d_position moveTransform = almath.Transform.fromPosition(move_3d.x, move_3d.y, move_3d.z) target_transformer_list = list(moveTransform.toVector()) times = [2.0] axis_mask_list = motion.AXIS_MASK_VEL self.motion.transformInterpolations(effector, frame, target_transformer_list, axis_mask_list, times). src: http://doc.aldebaran.com/1-14/dev/python/examples/almath/index.html?highlig… This question is specific to NAO environment but in general how to go about this task? what is a most common algorithm used in this case? Do I have to also get the side of the object in order to know where exactly the arms should be placed?

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Re: Decoding bytes to text strings in Python 2
by Rayner Lucas June 22, 2024

June 22, 2024

In article <Text-20240621184010(a)ram.dialup.fu-berlin.de>, ram(a)zedat.fu- berlin.de says... > > I didn't really do a super thorough deep dive on this, > but I'm just giving the initial impression without > actually being familiar with Tkinter under Python 2, > so I might be wrong! > > The Text widget typically expects text in Tcl encoding, > which is usually UTF-8. > > This is independent of the result returned by sys.get- > defaultencoding()! > > If a UTF-8 string is inserted directly as a bytes object, > its code points will be displayed correctly by the Text > widget as long as they are in the BMP (Basic Multilingual > Plane), as you already found out yourself. Many thanks, you've helped me greatly in understanding what's happening. When I tried running my example code on a different system (Python 2.7.18 on Linux, with Tcl/Tk 8.5), I got the error: _tkinter.TclError: character U+1f40d is above the range (U+0000-U+FFFF) allowed by Tcl So, as your reply suggests, the problem is ultimately a limitation of Tcl/Tk itself. Perhaps I should have spent more time studying the docs for that instead of puzzling over the details of character encodings in Python! I'm not sure why it doesn't give the same error on Windows, but at least now I know where the root of the issue is. I am now much better informed about how to migrate the code I'm working on, so I am very grateful for your help. Thanks, Rayner

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