🌐 Mailman 3 April 2003 - Pythonmac-SIG - python.org

Re: [Pythonmac-SIG] Python for OSX programming beginner?
by Russell E Owen March 20, 2005

March 20, 2005

>Been lurking here for a while and quietly observing. > >I am looking for a programming language and preferably and IDE for a >young nephew wanting to dip his toes in the programming pool... >Is Python worth further investigating and how good are the IDEs? >Is there something along the lines of REALbasic VisualBasic >integrated interface/code style IDE available? >What are the specialities limits of the language? >Why learn Python rather than battle on and master C or more >particularly Objective C ? >Rather difficult to answer, but how different is the learning curve? > >Many thanks for any help. Hmmm...I suggest the following: Smalltalk: Squeak and VisualWorks NC are both free (the latter only for noncommercial use). Smalltalk is a lovely, simple really powerful language that includes: - powerful IDE and class browser with integrated debugger; smalltalk has the best development environment I've ever seen for a language because it includes live debugging, live changing of classes (want to fix a method? go ahead; the change propagates; fix it and continue on the fly) - really simple yet powerful language; one of the most elegant languges I've seen, though the syntax is a bit different than C and Python programmers are used to - very rich class library, including one of the nicest collection classes (lists, sets, etc.) available Between these two, squeak is smaller and more fun and includes a nifty GUI called Morphic; however it all runs in one big window (very non-Mac like). VisualWorks is more Mac-like (at least on a Mac) and more mature, but is much larger. Both are fully cross-platform (write once, run everywhere). One limitation to smalltalk is that it's not much good for simple scripting, hence simple text processing scripts and such. Python really shines there, so... Python. This is a really nice language and he'll be able to go far with it. However, based on what you said above, some of its limitations make me nervous: - there is no really well integrated GUI, unlike the suggestions above. You can do GUI programming, but you have to choose a 3rd party package and they are fully powerful, but the two main ones (Tkinter and wxPython) are somewhat clumsy and poorly documented. - hence there is no really first rate IDE (not to put down the IDEs that are there, but in comparison to smalltalk or RealBasic...) Note: python is built into MacOS X 10.2, but it's an outdated version missing some of the things that make the language sane (such as readlines support and a GUI package). Install the missing items or a better package (if you've been reading you've seen various options for that including at least one recent binary installer). I suggest learning those two (since their few weaknesses are complimentary), but you could also consider: Buy RealBasic. The knowledge is well worth the money! It's not a wonderful language, but not so bad either and if he already knows it, well...that's a huge leg up. Java. Not sure what the IDE situation is for MacOS X, but the language is reasonable (much saner than C++). The problem is that the need to declare the type of all objects makes it a clumsy and messy language compared to Python and Smalltalk. I suggest NOT using C++. The language is too arcane and messy. The object model is insanely complicated and the pitfalls fill volumes. Learn to program first, then learn C++ later if you really have to. -- Russell

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Boa Constructor on Mac OS X?
by David Goodger May 3, 2003

May 3, 2003

Has anyone been able to run Boa Constructor on Mac OS X? I hacked a copy of the wxPython RunDemo.app to run Boa.pyw, but Boa crashes after a time with a Bus Error, and some of the interface elements are messed up (input fields on top of buttons, etc.). Any tips or links would be appreciated. OS X 10.2.5, MacPython 2.3a2 (framework), wxPython 2.4.0.7, Boa 0.2.3. -- David Goodger http://starship.python.net/~goodger Programmer/sysadmin for hire: http://starship.python.net/~goodger/cv

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For your eyes only - MacPython-OS9 2.3b1
by Jack Jansen May 2, 2003

May 2, 2003

And a MacPython-OS9 2.3b1 installer is also available. Again: please test it and send reports here, I will announce it wider after I've seen a couple of positive reports. Oh yes: please also mention your OS version (so that I don't announce it before I've had successes from at least OSX and OS9). Download from <http://www.cwi.nl/ftp/jack/python/mac/MacPython23b1full.bin>. An active installer and BinHex versions are also available, source will come shortly. -- - Jack Jansen <Jack.Jansen(a)oratrix.com> http://www.cwi.nl/~jack - - If I can't dance I don't want to be part of your revolution -- Emma Goldman -

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Fwd: [Scipy-chaco] scipy/chaco package for OSX
by Lance Boyle May 2, 2003

May 2, 2003

This message appeared a few days ago on the scipy-chaco list. I hope the author doesn't mind me forwarding it to this list. Jerry Begin forwarded message: > From: Jeffrey.S.Whitaker(a)noaa.gov > Date: Wed Apr 23, 2003 09:46:21 America/Phoenix > To: scipy-chaco(a)scipy.org > Subject: [Scipy-chaco] scipy/chaco package for OSX > Reply-To: scipy-chaco(a)scipy.org > > > Hi all: > > I've updated the fink (http://fink.sf.net) scipy package - it now > includes a working chaco using wxpython/wxgtk! > > The gtk/wxpython interface seems a bit peppier and more robust than the > native OS X interface at this point. > > To install it, update your package descriptions from cvs ("fink > selfupdate-cvs"), enable the unstable tree > (http://fink.sourceforge.net/faq/usage-fink.php#unstable) and "fink > install scipy-py23". > > Right now the package is only available for python23. > > > BTW: Here is what I get from scipy.test() on OS 10.2.5 with > python-2.3a2 > > Ran 739 tests in 18.147s > > FAILED (failures=70, errors=2) > > There are a lot of failures like this: > > ====================================================================== > FAIL: check_cdf (test_distributions.test_tukeylambda) > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Traceback (most recent call last): > File "<string>", line 10, in check_cdf > AssertionError: D = NaN; pval = NaN; alpha = 0.01 > args = (1.2585851608415324,) > > from test.distributions > > and > > ====================================================================== > FAIL: check_nd (test_function_base.test_all) > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Traceback (most recent call last): > File > "/sw/src/root-scipy-py23-20030415-2/sw/lib/python2.3/site-packages/ > scipy_base/tests/test_function_base.py", > line 38, in check_nd > File > "/sw/src/root-scipy-py23-20030415-2/sw/lib/python2.3/site-packages/ > scipy_test/testing.py", > line 390, in assert_array_equal > AssertionError: > Arrays are not equal: > > from test_function_base. > > > -Jeff > > -- > Jeffrey S. Whitaker Phone : (303)497-6313 > NOAA/OAR/CDC R/CDC1 FAX : (303)497-6449 > 325 Broadway Web : http://www.cdc.noaa.gov/~jsw > Boulder, CO, USA 80305-3328 Office: Skaggs Research Cntr 1D-124 > > _______________________________________________ > Scipy-chaco mailing list > Scipy-chaco(a)scipy.org > http://scipy.net/mailman/listinfo/scipy-chaco >

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Re: [Pythonmac-SIG] For your eyes only - MacPython-OSX binary distribution
by Russell E Owen April 29, 2003

April 29, 2003

I just tried the binary installer and it ran fine. I really liked the nice clear simple ReadMe file and the IDE help as well. The one problem I have is that it didn't install Tkinter. I thought that *might* be because my most recent Tcl/Tk installation was an X11 binary (though I have both that and a framework build installed), but I ran the new Aqua Tk 8.4.2 binary installer and reinstalled MacPython 2.3b1-1 and still...no Tkinter. So I'm about to try building Python 2.3b1 from source. -- Russell

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RE: [Pythonmac-SIG] For your eyes only - MacPython-OSX binary distribution
by Bugbee, Larry April 29, 2003

April 29, 2003

So I'm about to try building Python 2.3b1 from source. -- Russell If you build from source you may want to make one tempory change in Tkinter.py, line 1572. ....str(tcl_version) http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=729317&group_id=54… Larry

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For your eyes only - MacPython-OSX binary distribution
by Jack Jansen April 29, 2003

April 29, 2003

Folks, a MacPython-OSX 2.3b1 binary distribution is available at <http://www.cwi.nl/ftp/jack/python/mac/MacPython-OSX-2.3b1-1.dmg>. This is the first time I've tried to build such an installer, the tools I used are based on the work from Robin Dunn and the wxPython folks. Please give it a try and let me know whether it works, so I can announce it more widely later. This will take a while, though, probably a week or so, because I first want to update the packages that can be installed with Package Manager. -- - Jack Jansen <Jack.Jansen(a)oratrix.com> http://www.cwi.nl/~jack - - If I can't dance I don't want to be part of your revolution -- Emma Goldman -

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Receiver Virus Alert
by e-mmunity＠electric.net April 28, 2003

April 28, 2003

This is the E-mmunity virus scanning service at the Electric Mail Company (www.electricmail.com). An email virus was found. Please see details of the virus below: Date: Mon Apr 28 12:40:27 2003 Recipient: pythonmac-sig(a)python.org Sender: turtle1(a)eastontelecom.com Message id: 19AEU7-000Gg4-0W{MM-19AEUF-000GiM-00000L-000} Subject: And installation. If you run into trouble, see Virus name: W32.Klez.H@mm Attachment: http.exe Status: Attachment(s) deleted Notified: recipient, sender Thank you for using our services --- The Electric Mail Company www.electricmail.com 604-482-1111

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(no subject)
by Jerry Bauck April 26, 2003

April 26, 2003

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Re: [Pythonmac-SIG] SciPy-0.2.0
by Andrew Straw April 23, 2003

April 23, 2003

On Sunday, April 20, 2003, at 07:02 AM, Willard Myers wrote: > On Friday, Apr 18, 2003, at 00:35 America/New_York, Andrew Straw wrote: > >> I've got scipy working just fine on my mac os x box. I'm using >> MacPython 2.3a2 and a recent CVS checkout of scipy. > > Thanks! It helps to know that it is doable. > > If you have a moment, I'd like to know how you dealt with building the > fortran source, and whether or not you found a way to use Apple's BLAS > and LAPACK libraries in the vecLib framework? That's funny -- I asked the same thing on the SciPy list several months ago. It seems like a good idea, but IIRC the scipy folks wrap fortran, and I think the apple stuff is CLAPACK. Still, although I'm not an expert on this stuff and haven't done any benchmarking, I've been using ATLAS, which seems fast. I used fink to install atlas, etc (and even a version of python that I never use), and then I compiled scipy from CVS after creating (from a default copy sitting nearby) scipy_core/scipy_distutils/site.cfg and adding /sw/lib and /sw/include to the [DEFAULT] section. It's worth it. Cheers! Andrew

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