🌐 Mailman 3 May 2003 - Pythonmac-SIG - python.org

Re: [Pythonmac-SIG] Python for OSX programming beginner?
by Russell E Owen March 20, 2005

March 20, 2005

>Been lurking here for a while and quietly observing. > >I am looking for a programming language and preferably and IDE for a >young nephew wanting to dip his toes in the programming pool... >Is Python worth further investigating and how good are the IDEs? >Is there something along the lines of REALbasic VisualBasic >integrated interface/code style IDE available? >What are the specialities limits of the language? >Why learn Python rather than battle on and master C or more >particularly Objective C ? >Rather difficult to answer, but how different is the learning curve? > >Many thanks for any help. Hmmm...I suggest the following: Smalltalk: Squeak and VisualWorks NC are both free (the latter only for noncommercial use). Smalltalk is a lovely, simple really powerful language that includes: - powerful IDE and class browser with integrated debugger; smalltalk has the best development environment I've ever seen for a language because it includes live debugging, live changing of classes (want to fix a method? go ahead; the change propagates; fix it and continue on the fly) - really simple yet powerful language; one of the most elegant languges I've seen, though the syntax is a bit different than C and Python programmers are used to - very rich class library, including one of the nicest collection classes (lists, sets, etc.) available Between these two, squeak is smaller and more fun and includes a nifty GUI called Morphic; however it all runs in one big window (very non-Mac like). VisualWorks is more Mac-like (at least on a Mac) and more mature, but is much larger. Both are fully cross-platform (write once, run everywhere). One limitation to smalltalk is that it's not much good for simple scripting, hence simple text processing scripts and such. Python really shines there, so... Python. This is a really nice language and he'll be able to go far with it. However, based on what you said above, some of its limitations make me nervous: - there is no really well integrated GUI, unlike the suggestions above. You can do GUI programming, but you have to choose a 3rd party package and they are fully powerful, but the two main ones (Tkinter and wxPython) are somewhat clumsy and poorly documented. - hence there is no really first rate IDE (not to put down the IDEs that are there, but in comparison to smalltalk or RealBasic...) Note: python is built into MacOS X 10.2, but it's an outdated version missing some of the things that make the language sane (such as readlines support and a GUI package). Install the missing items or a better package (if you've been reading you've seen various options for that including at least one recent binary installer). I suggest learning those two (since their few weaknesses are complimentary), but you could also consider: Buy RealBasic. The knowledge is well worth the money! It's not a wonderful language, but not so bad either and if he already knows it, well...that's a huge leg up. Java. Not sure what the IDE situation is for MacOS X, but the language is reasonable (much saner than C++). The problem is that the need to declare the type of all objects makes it a clumsy and messy language compared to Python and Smalltalk. I suggest NOT using C++. The language is too arcane and messy. The object model is insanely complicated and the pitfalls fill volumes. Learn to program first, then learn C++ later if you really have to. -- Russell

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CF module oddity
by Ronald Oussoren June 13, 2003

June 13, 2003

I've been playing with the Carbon.CF module, mostly because I want to add "toll-free" bridgeing to a future version of PyObjC. I noticed something strange: >>> import Carbon.CF >>> s = Carbon.CF.CFStringCreateWithCharacters("hello") >>> s.toPython() u'\u6865\u6c6c' >>> Is this intentional? Using u"hello" instead of "hello" gives a better result. This is with Python2.3b1 (actually a more recent CVS version). Ronald

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Shelve ... Denied!
by Israel C. Evans June 7, 2003

June 7, 2003

hello there friendly python people. I'm currently attempting to use the shelve module in a couple of cgi scripts and after having gone through and gotten nearly everything working on the command line, I'm running into brick walls inside my browser. I'm using MacOS X 10.2.6 with a build of apache 2.0.4x with python 2.3a2. The error occurs when I try to open up a shelve. I'm not sure if it has to do with permissions since I've already made all involved cgi files and the shelve db executable and chmoded to 755. I'm thinking it might have something to do with the flags I'm using to open up the shelve, but they are the only way I could figure out how to open them in the console. here is the bit that python or maybe apache chokes on: db = shelve.open('200305','c') and this gives me this error (condensed due to the size of the cgitb traceback info I get). error: (13, 'Permission denied') args = (13, 'Permission denied') Does anyone have any clues as to why this might be happening? I would gratefully appreciate any help you might have to offer. Thanks, ~Israel~

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Helloooooooo
by Dispatch＠McAfee.com May 31, 2003

May 31, 2003

WARNING: This e-mail has been altered by MIMEDefang. Following this paragraph are indications of the actual changes made. For more information about your site's MIMEDefang policy, contact NETDOOR Spam Filter Administrator <filter-admin(a)netdoor.com>. For more information about MIMEDefang, see: http://support.netdoor.com/email/filtering.html An attachment named The_Truth_of_Love.pif was removed from this document as it constituted a security hazard. If you require this document, please contact the sender and arrange an alternate means of receiving it. I've got your email , but you forgot to upload the attachments. Don't be selfish , i sent you all the files i have, send me anything :( bye

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PackageManager from CVS crashes
by Jan de Leeuw May 31, 2003

May 31, 2003

Opens window, but then crashes. Date/Time: 2003-05-30 22:21:02 -0700 OS Version: 10.2.6 (Build 6L60) Host: cabledoc112.frazmtn.com Command: python.exe PID: 2053 Exception: EXC_BAD_ACCESS (0x0001) Codes: KERN_PROTECTION_FAILURE (0x0002) at 0x00000000 Thread 0 Crashed: #0 0x040c360c in AEHandleOApp(AEDesc const*, AEDesc*, long) #1 0x91b56570 in aeDispatchAppleEvent(AEDesc const*, AEDesc*, unsigned long, unsigned char*) #2 0x91b590cc in dispatchEventAndSendReply(AEDesc const*, AEDesc*) #3 0x91b56478 in aeProcessAppleEvent #4 0x96a83778 in AEProcessAppleEvent #5 0x0092dea8 in AE_AEProcessAppleEvent (_AEmodule.c:1098) #6 0x1007654c in call_function (ceval.c:3418) #7 0x10074144 in eval_frame (ceval.c:2095) #8 0x10076794 in fast_function (ceval.c:3498) #9 0x10076624 in call_function (ceval.c:3436) #10 0x10074144 in eval_frame (ceval.c:2095) #11 0x10076794 in fast_function (ceval.c:3498) #12 0x10076624 in call_function (ceval.c:3436) #13 0x10074144 in eval_frame (ceval.c:2095) #14 0x1007543c in PyEval_EvalCodeEx (ceval.c:2641) #15 0x10076828 in fast_function (ceval.c:3507) #16 0x10076624 in call_function (ceval.c:3436) #17 0x10074144 in eval_frame (ceval.c:2095) #18 0x1007543c in PyEval_EvalCodeEx (ceval.c:2641) #19 0x10076828 in fast_function (ceval.c:3507) #20 0x10076624 in call_function (ceval.c:3436) #21 0x10074144 in eval_frame (ceval.c:2095) #22 0x1007543c in PyEval_EvalCodeEx (ceval.c:2641) #23 0x100252a8 in function_call (funcobject.c:504) #24 0x1000bf90 in PyObject_Call (abstract.c:1756) #25 0x10015420 in instancemethod_call (classobject.c:2433) #26 0x1000bf90 in PyObject_Call (abstract.c:1756) #27 0x100763e0 in PyEval_CallObjectWithKeywords (ceval.c:3325) #28 0x1000e710 in PyInstance_New (classobject.c:576) #29 0x1000bf90 in PyObject_Call (abstract.c:1756) #30 0x1007694c in do_call (ceval.c:3622) #31 0x1007663c in call_function (ceval.c:3439) #32 0x10074144 in eval_frame (ceval.c:2095) #33 0x1007543c in PyEval_EvalCodeEx (ceval.c:2641) #34 0x100782a8 in PyEval_EvalCode (ceval.c:537) #35 0x100a9030 in run_node (pythonrun.c:1175) #36 0x100a87dc in PyRun_SimpleFileExFlags (pythonrun.c:774) #37 0x100b4f68 in Py_Main (main.c:415) #38 0x00001b5c in _start (crt.c:267) #39 0x000019dc in start Thread 1: #0 0x9002578c in select #1 0x0a076e94 in NotifierThreadProc #2 0x90020d28 in _pthread_body PPC Thread State: srr0: 0x040c360c srr1: 0x0200f030 vrsave: 0x00000000 xer: 0x00000000 lr: 0x040c35ec ctr: 0x040c35e0 mq: 0x00000000 r0: 0xbfffea10 r1: 0xbfffe8a0 r2: 0x48022242 r3: 0x00000000 r4: 0xbfffea10 r5: 0xbfffea20 r6: 0xbfffe8c0 r7: 0xbfffe930 r8: 0x100966bc r9: 0x00000001 r10: 0x901a3e10 r11: 0x00bcbee0 r12: 0x040c35e0 r13: 0x000e28cc r14: 0x008d1030 r15: 0x10101d08 r16: 0x00000000 r17: 0x00000000 r18: 0x00000006 r19: 0x00000005 r20: 0x00000000 r21: 0x000e28e8 r22: 0xbfffe9b0 r23: 0xbfffea20 r24: 0x00000000 r25: 0xbfffea10 r26: 0x61657674 r27: 0x00000001 r28: 0x6f617070 r29: 0xfffff954 r30: 0x00be60a0 r31: 0x040c35ec === Jan de Leeuw; Professor and Chair, UCLA Department of Statistics; Editor: Journal of Multivariate Analysis, Journal of Statistical Software US mail: 9432 Boelter Hall, Box 951554, Los Angeles, CA 90095-1554 phone (310)-825-9550; fax (310)-206-5658; email: deleeuw(a)stat.ucla.edu homepage: http://gifi.stat.ucla.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------- No matter where you go, there you are. --- Buckaroo Banzai http://gifi.stat.ucla.edu/sounds/nomatter.au ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -------------------------

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Delivery Status Notification (Failure)
by postmaster＠lse.ac.uk May 31, 2003

May 31, 2003

This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification. Delivery to the following recipients failed. N.C.Nwosu(a)lse.ac.uk

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2.3b1 installer options
by Bugbee, Larry May 31, 2003

May 31, 2003

Jack, In addition to 'Demos' and 'Tools', shouldn't we add 'Doc'? Larry

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The Spanish Beauty
by drift1＠bellsouth.net May 31, 2003

May 31, 2003

it's a mix of the Arabian beauty & the european grace ! satisfy your eyes with the beauty that u have never seen ;)

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Re: [Pythonmac-SIG] Segmentation Fault with AppleScripting
by Just van Rossum May 30, 2003

May 30, 2003

Martina Oefelein wrote: > You can also do this without AppleScripting: > url = NSURL.URLWithString_("http://www.apple.com") > wsp = NSWorkspace.sharedWorkspace() > wsp.openURL_(url) You can also do this without PyObjC: import webbrowser webbrowser.open("http://www.python.org/") (as a bonus, this is cross-platform) Just

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Segmentation Fault with AppleScripting
by Bob Swerdlow May 30, 2003

May 30, 2003

I'm writing a Mac OS X application in Python and trying to use AppleScripting to open a web location. However, I seem to be having trouble allocating and releasing the NSAppleScript class properly. Here is the problematic section of code: def openWebSite(self) strScript = 'open location "http://www.apple.com"' appleScript = NSAppleScript.alloc().initWithSource_(strScript) appleScript.executeAndReturnError_(None) appleScript.release() The result of calling this code is a Segmentation Fault. If I leave out the last line (appleScript.release()) then there does not seem to be a problem (though I think that would be a memory leak). What am I doing wrong? Bob Swerdlow COO Transpose rswerdlow(a)transpose.com 207-781-8284 http://www.transpose.com ---------------------------------- Fight Spam! Add this link to your signature (as I did): http://wecanstopspam.org Click through to find out more. ----------------------------------

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