🌐 Mailman 3 January 2004 - Python-list - python.org

Zope
by lenk Feb. 4, 2004

Feb. 4, 2004

Hi I installed zope in suse 9.0(own package).but i can t find start to start the server . /opt/zope/ ... is it a right path ? second problem Can you give an web example for python (forum,gueastbook ...) links pls:) thanks for all

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How your company think about python?
by d2002xx Feb. 4, 2004

Feb. 4, 2004

Hi all. I've posted a similiar message in comp.lang.java.advocacy, just for curious, but it seems that most people don't know about python... Would you tell me how your company (or your boss, colleagues) think about python? A possible next-generation mainstream? Or just another script? Or they even never heard it? Also, If your company wants to create a new software, will you recommand them to use python even if your boss/colleagues don't know about it? How you tell them the benefits from python? Why or why not?

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Re: easiest transition for a PHP website to move to Python?
by llothar＠web.de Feb. 3, 2004

Feb. 3, 2004

Python Baby <python(a)hitmedia.com> wrote in message news:<mailman.1023.1075441969.12720.python-list(a)python.org>... > I've got a database-driven website that's written entirely in PHP. > > It's all pretty MVC : NOT embedded little calls inside HTML, but > rather little controller apps in the webroot that merge data with > HTML templates on the fly. > > But for various reasons (mostly fun) I want to rewrite it in Python. > > There are so many different approaches, though! Zope, Twisted, > mod_python, clearsilver, and all the goodies in standard library. > > What would be the SMOOTHEST TRANSITION for a newbie like me to > rewrite my PHP+MySQL website to Python? > > Most important, what can you use ? If you are independ, this means have your own dedicated or virtual server, then i would suggest webware which is the most sophisticated real python (Zope is not python) solution. Twisted is more a server framework then a web solution. If you don't want a app server then use mod_python with one of the ten web frameworks. Look at www.python-hosting.com for a list. I recommend Quixote or Sypce.

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Re: How does compare work?
by Helmut Jarausch Feb. 3, 2004

Feb. 3, 2004

Terry Reedy wrote: > "Helmut Jarausch" <jarausch(a)skynet.be> wrote in message > news:40158680$0$7044$ba620e4c@news.skynet.be... > >>what does Python do if two objects aren't comparable (to my opinion) > > > Sorry, Python does what it does, which is generally to compare any two > objects unless explicitly disabled as with complex numbers or in > user-written method of user class. > > >>If I've understood "Python in a Nutschell" correctly it should raise an >>exception but it doesn't do for me. > > > Perhaps you could quote the line that mislead you, and someone could > explain, or suggest a change to the author. > First let me say that IMHO this is a big misdesign of Python. I've come to Python from Perl since many posts convinced me that Python is safer - and mostly it is. But silently(!) comparing apples with pears is evil. E.g. the example I came across this was thresh=raw_input('enter threshold') ... level=2 ... if level > thresh : which failed miserably. By the way, Perl does convert the string to an integer silenty and, as most of the time, these Perl conversions are just what one wants, so here. Nevertheless, I'd prefer an exception in this case since automatic conversions can never be right in all circumstances. So this is a case where Python is a very dangerous language! For the quotation In my 'Python in a Nutshell' by Alex Martelli (a tremendously good book), 1st edition on page 91 (Special Methods) it reads __cmp__ ...... ............... When __cmp__ is also absent, order comparisons (<,<=,>,>=) raise exceptions. Equality comparisons (==,!=), in this case, become identity checks: x==y evaluates id(x)==id(y) (i.e., x is y) end of quotation. I wish this were true for the current Python implementation. Helmut. -- Helmut Jarausch Lehrstuhl fuer Numerische Mathematik RWTH - Aachen University D 52056 Aachen, Germany

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Python vs. Io
by LittleDanEhren＠yahoo.com Feb. 3, 2004

Feb. 3, 2004

Io (www.iolanguage.com) is a new programming language that's purely object-oriented (but with prototypes), has a powerful concurrency mechanism via actors, and uses an extremely flexible syntax because all code is a modifiable message tree. Like Python, it is dynamically typed, has a very clean syntax, produces short code, and is excruciatingly slow (on the same level as eachother). Io has a unique syntax combining Lisp's idea of functions for flow control with traditional function syntax and smalltalk-like syntax to get slots of objects. Io has no keywords and everything, even multiple lines of code, can be used as an expression. Even as a beginner to Io, I was able to write something in just 43 lines to let you do something like this (and more) in Io: each((key, value) in map(x=1, y=2, z=3), write(key, ": ", value, "\n") ) Neither the each function nor the map function were built in (Io has other mechanisms for that kind of thing, but they are less efficient). Can anyone show me how to so much as alias "for" to "each" in Python or allow block syntax at all without hacking the C source code? Io doesn't use __methods_with_this_annoying_syntax__ because nothing is supposed to be for internal use only and there are only about three functions that would cause a problem if overridden. For embedding, Io doesn't have to use Py_ALL_CAPS, instead it just uses IoCamelCase, which looks much better. Interfaces to C are much more object oriented. Many users of Io (myself included) have switched over from Python for these reasons. I guess there are still the obvious advantages of Python over Io, including *large community *more bindings to stuff *strict coding conventions *inflexible so everything is the same *no need to close blocks But unless there are other problems, the first two go away soon (considering that Io was first created just two years ago). The last three are somewhat trivial and may even be to Io's advantage. Daniel Ehrenberg

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OT: why do web BBS's and blogs get so slow?
by Paul Rubin Feb. 3, 2004

Feb. 3, 2004

Lots of times, when a blog (that supports user comments) or a web BBS gets heavily loaded, it slows down horribly, even when it's hosted at an ISP on a fast computer with plenty of net bandwidth. I'm wondering what those programs are doing, that makes them bog down so badly. Anyone know what the main bottlenecks are? I'm just imagining them doing a bunch of really dumb things. I'm asking this on clpy because thinking about the problem naturally made me wonder how I'd write a program like that myself, which of course would mean using Python. FWIW, here's how I'd do it: 1) It would be single threaded web server (asyncore, twistedmatrix) with a select loop talking to a socket, either on port 80 directly, or to a proxy web server running mod_gzip, SSL, and so forth. 2) It might use MySQL for infrequent operations like user info lookup at login time or preference updates, but not for frequent operations like reading and posting messages. User session info and preferences would be in ram during a session, in a python dict indexed by a browser session cookie. 3) The message store would be two files, one for metadata and one for message text. Both of these would be mmap'd into memory. There would be a fixed length of metadata for each message, so getting the metadata for message #N would be a single array lookup. The metadata would contain the location in the text file where the message text is and its length, so getting the text would take just one memcpy. The box would have enough ram to hold all recently active messages in ram almost all the time. Paging to disk is left to the host OS's virtual memory system. From the application's point of view everything is always in ram. Digging up old messages might take some page faults, but doing that should be relatively rare. New messages are always appended to the files, keeping memory and paging behavior fairly localized. There might be a third file for an activity log, which is append-only (serial access). Ideally that would be on a separate disk from the message disk, to reduce head contention. 4) Finding all N messages in an active discussion thread might require chasing N pointers in the metadata file, but that would usually be at most a few thousand small lookups, all in ram, and the thread info would be cached in ram in the application once found. Fancier disk structures could speed this up but probably arn't needed. A site like Slashdot gets maybe 20(?) page views per second at busy times, and around 10,000 new messages a day of maybe 1 kbyte each, a mere 10 MB per day of message text, no problem to keep in ram. I'd like to think that the above scheme could handle Slashdot's traffic level pretty easily on one or two typical current PC's with IDE disks, one PC for the BBS application and the other (if needed) for a proxy server running gzip and caching static pages. Am I being naive and/or missing something important? Slashdot itself uses a tremendous amount of hardware by comparison.

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Programmers Wanted for Computer Graphics Startup Near Philadelphia
by CGStartup＠earthlink.net Feb. 2, 2004

Feb. 2, 2004

My name is Stan Schwartz, and I'm a University of Pennsylvania Ph.D. and an independent inventor. I'm submitting two computer graphics patents to the USPTO during the next several weeks. Technologies derived from these patents have application in several different market segments, including still image photomanipulation, movie special effects and post-production, web animation, and video games. I'm developing and marketing one or more of the applications through a startup company. I've produced demo output that clearly demonstrates the viability of my approaches, which I've been showing to potential licensees and investors. This demo output is currently being generated through a loosely connected series of scripts. To be productized the scripts will need to be recoded into standalone "industrial strength" applications that are much faster, bullet-proof, and that have slick GUIs. I'm looking for a lead/senior programmer to participate in and organize the implementation side of the startup and probably one or more junior programmers. Successful candidates for the programming team should have some to many of the following skills/characteristics: Extensible knowledge of/comfort with math, as exemplified by one or more of: Computer vision training/experience - feature location/ extraction, motion estimation, object recognition; Image processing training/experience - you know what a convolution kernel is; you've implemented a morphing algorithm; Linear algebra training/experience - matrix manipulation, familiarity with numeric computation packages, such as Numerical Python, or equivalent; Art/math programming play, mathematical visualization; 3D modeling, especially for character animation, especially if you've hacked/manipulated low-level 3D data representations in a variety of formats; GUI design/building, graphic design training a plus; Analysis of algorithms; C/C++, Linux/Unix a plus; (Note that I did most of the scripting mentioned above in Python through PIL and Numerical Python and would consider doing as much as we can of this in Python.) Startup and/or major fielded product development experience required for the lead/senior programmer, a plus for juniors; Within commuting distance of Philadelphia - we may move and/or outsource, but this is where/how we'll start; Relevant educational background is a plus, but I'm more interested in what you can demonstrate to me that you know, can do, and have done, than what you've formally studied; Intellectual flexibility, creativity, and ability to work and brainstorm collaboratively; Open-ended time commitment - After growing this, I have additional ideas in the queue that could be spun off into future products; and Demonstrable artistic skills and training in figurative painting, sculpture, and/or life-drawing are a plus. We have access to seed capital, and we'd prefer if participants accept some portion of salary as equity in our venture. If you're interested in participating, send me a cover letter and resume at cgstartup(a)earthlink.net. I'm willing to show you the demo and provide more details about the technology, although first you'll have to sign a non-disclosure agreement. The demo can also be posted temporarily to the web for online viewing, accompanied by an explanatory phone call. For Investors/Licensees: If you're a potential investor in the startup or a representative of a company that is potentially interested in licensing one of the applications and are interested in seeing the demo and hearing a description of the technologies, also under conditions of non-disclosure, please let me know through the means described above. Thanks for your time, Stan

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Simple list question
by C GIllespie Feb. 2, 2004

Feb. 2, 2004

Dear all, I have a list something like this: ['1','+','2'], I went to go through and change the numbers to floats, e.g. [1,'+',2]. What's the best way of doing this? The way I done it seems wrong, e.g. nod=['1','+','2'] i=0 while i<len(nod): if nod[i] !='+' or nod[i] !='-' or nod[i]!='*' or nod[i] != '/' or nod[i] != '(' or nod[i] != ')': nod[i] = float(nod[i]) i = i + 1 Comments? Thanks Colin

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Pythonwin - breaking out of infinite loop
by Graham Feb. 2, 2004

Feb. 2, 2004

How do I stop a Python program running in PythinWin? I would expect to be able to use CTR-C or CTRL-break etc. many thanks Graham Smith PeopleSoft Technical Team Leader OXFAM GB +44 (1865) 313255 gsmith(a)oxfam.org.uk

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wxPython documentation
by Olivier Feb. 2, 2004

Feb. 2, 2004

Where could I find a good documentation about wxPython (a documentation which is not for C++ !!!) Olivier

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